Engine Problems Mk Mondeo

[jivemonkey]

After some advice. Recently bought a mk 4 mondeo diesel 09 with 61k on the clock.

I get white smoke with a smell of diesel on starting. Gone after less than a minute. Also rough at start. Back to dealer under warranty twice. Told they can't find the problem and checked injectors twice.

Car then developed a tapping. Back to dealer. Told it's a cam shaft problem with the cam lobe? They have had my car a week. Told they need it another week.

I also get a wooing mooing noise when I depress the clutch at times. They cannot find the cause.

I am still within warranty. My question is should i be worried I have bought a knackered car to have problems they cannot fix and a critical engine failure at 61 k? The book had a 34k gap with no service stamps but the dealer assured me they checked the car fully and it was ok. Thinking of asking for my money back...should i be worried. Advice appreciated.

[MONDEO TXS 2.2]

White smoke in diesel exhaust indicates either unburnt diesel or water.

[jivemonkey]

Thanks. Just spoken to dealer. Now saying will need the car at least another 10 days and possible a new (used) engine may need to be put in the car!

[jeebowhite]

Awesome result eh :/ the clutch noise suggests a dmf and clutch issue to me...

[BOF]

I get white smoke with a smell of diesel on starting. Gone after less than a minute. Also rough at start. Back to dealer under warranty twice. Told they can't find the problem and checked injectors twice.

Well, that problem may have become irrelevant (...let's see...) if they are going to change the engine. Not sure exactly what it was, but there is a good chance that changing the engine will cure it.

Car then developed a tapping. Back to dealer. Told it's a cam shaft problem with the cam lobe? They have had my car a week. Told they need it another week.

It is likely to be either a camshaft problem (worn lobe) or a cam follower problem. This falls in to the category of 'serious stuff'.

The book had a 34k gap with no service stamps but the dealer assured me they checked the car fully and it was ok.

It also falls in to the category of 'stuff that is more likely to happen if no one changes the oil, for 20k plus miles, particularly of the car is used much, round town (rather than motorways and dual carriageway stuff)'.

Well, it isn't clear that no one changed the oil, but the finger of suspicion must point that way.

It might be interesting to ask what exactly did they check to assure you that the car was ok. You'd have to suspect that it was a superficial check of some kind, but the problems you have had seem excessive for a car that has been through a 'thorough' check.

I also get a wooing mooing noise when I depress the clutch at times. They cannot find the cause.

Like Jeebo, I am tempted to suspect DMF; I haven't heard exactly this description ('wooing, mooing') before, but noises that change when the clutch is depressed do tend to point that way.

It is expensive, but if they are changing the whole engine/gearbox, you'll get a replacement one as a matter of course.

Thinking of asking for my money back...should i be worried. Advice appreciated.

I think that you should make clear to them that you are worried, you have been inconvenienced by not having the car when you could have legitimately expected to have it, and that the car has to work when you get it back - work fully, and with no problems. And, given that the car has not really been working, so far, you should probably chance your arm and say that you want the full guarantee period, starting from when you get the car back, working (ie, not that the guarantee has already run down a month or so, in the period the car hasn't been working).

It may be worth considering getting an independent report on the car, when they have finished. Of course, this only works if they will fix whatever problems show up; if they won't, you may as well just ask for your money back now.

The alternative, if they are uncooperative, is just to say "well, give me my money back, then". And the fact that this is your option should motivate them to fix it. Of course, if they are useless, that may not help.

It could be that you have, in a way, lucked out, in that you have bought a car that has not been cared for, but the replacement of the engine has cured the big problems. On the other hand, it could be that this garage is an inept load of baskets and you should never trust them to do anything. Either of those could be true, or maybe even both are partly true. Almost impossible to say from a distance.

[jivemonkey]

I am more thinking having spent 6k on a car that a month and a half after purchase suffers a critical engine failure. How strong is my legal position in seeking a refund. This car seems to be a lemon and no longer have any faith in it....or the dealer who inspected the white smoke and wooing noise twice before and admitted the other day they have not checked the egr valve yet

[jeebowhite]

You have every right. The vehicle is not fit for purpose, is not as described, they have had long enough to resolve it and it isn't resolved. You've plenty of reasons to return it, but mileage will raise a eyebrow. If you have done barely any the it's easier but if you have done thousands of miles then it's harder to say you haven't accepted it

[Goodkat]

I would be contemplating seeking advice in regards to rejection, but fair play that they are looking at engine change, they do look as though they are trying to rectify the issues, so I would give them a chance on it. Have they provided a courtesy car free of charge for the meantime? If not I would be insisting on that.

Sent from my Gen 1 WAP phone

[BOF]

I am more thinking having spent 6k on a car that a month and a half after purchase suffers a critical engine failure. How strong is my legal position in seeking a refund. This car seems to be a lemon and no longer have any faith in it....or the dealer who inspected the white smoke and wooing noise twice before and admitted the other day they have not checked the egr valve yet

I have to say that I am most worried by the fact that the dealer has either

• been unlucky
• is useless

from this distance, you can't tell which, but, if they are useless and they are about to replace the engine, that gives me cause for concern.

The car itself seems to have been, effectively, unmaintained for a significant time, and while that's also a worry, the thing that I'd be most worried about (engine/gearbox/dmf/injectors) is about to be replaced.

One thing that you may want to think about, is that what you thought that you had bought was a low mileage car (although, I always say that I am not worried about higher mileage, provided the car has been serviced regularly and cared for; so, my personal opinion is that low mileage is often over-valued).

What presumably you wouldn't want, though, is a low mileage car with a high mileage engine... so, at the risk of sounding pretentious about all this, you'd probably want to know something about the provenance of the engine.

[jivemonkey]

You have every right. The vehicle is not fit for purpose, is not as described, they have had long enough to resolve it and it isn't resolved. You've plenty of reasons to return it, but mileage will raise a eyebrow. If you have done barely any the it's easier but if you have done thousands of miles then it's harder to say you haven't accepted it

Only had it 1.5 months. Done about 1k miles in that time so not massive. Dealer now said they will source me a new car to replace it and transfer my stereo and speaker upgrades to the new car. Ok with that but they did say it may take a m9nth or so to source a car. I the meantime have a very small automatic car which is ok but need to drive to Holland and Belgium in two weeks and not so great in courtesy car.

[jeebowhite]

Well St least they are doing the right thing. Although I would ask if you could borrow a larger car for your trip state the small one will not do and that if you have to hire a car you will have to ask them to pay the bill as it's an associated financial expense due to the fault with the car you bought. As such you are within your rights to request they pay it.

[JPBromley]

Sorry if I'm hijacking this post but I'm new to the forum and this seems closest to the issues I have... Any help would be greatly appreciated :o)  I'm an English guy living in Sydney, Australia and there doesn't seem to be that many people who seem to deal with/know how to diagnose diesel cars

I have a 2011 Mondeo Mk4 MC TDCi Titanium Hatch - It has 83k kms (52k miles roughly) that's having issues on starting.

I go to start it in the morning - I push the start button and it will start and then cuts out.... i push the button again and sometimes it will start and cut out again, other times the revs will be slow and laboured for a few seconds then it will settle down and revs will be normal and the car will be fine to drive as normal.

When I come to the car in the afternoon/early evening after working for 8hrs, the same thing happens again.  I found that if I went to start the car at lunchtime (after 4-5hrs) it would not have issues starting 3-4 hrs later when I went to drive home.

I took it to my local garage and they had a look... they told me that they couldn't really do anything and that I should take it to a diesel specialist - all the guy could tell me was that there were no fault codes on the ecu and he thought it was losing fuel pressure so maybe an injector could be leaking - the problem was that the symptoms only show up once every 5+ hrs or so.

I spoke to a couple of different guys on the phone yesterday and described the issue... One said there's a cut out solenoid in the pump that can play up (?) and the other said about leaking injectors too - either way they would need my car for a few days to find and then fix the issue.

A friend in the uk with a mk3 mondeo tdci had similar issues and garages told him it was injectors- it seems to be a standard go-to answer to this kinda thing - it turned out to be crank/camshaft sensors. He told me to ensure that whoever I take it to does a 'leak back test'.

Can anyone give me any info on what it could be, what to look for, etc as I want to try to limit the $$$ that I'm inevitably going to pay out...  If its going to be expensive I will trade it in while its still running ok once its been started.

Thanks in advance

Edited June 4, 2016 by JPBromley
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[jeebowhite]

sounds like a diesel fielter issue at the moment?