27 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

Barometric pressure is ambient air pressure.  That won't change much over a drive.  Will change slightly day to day but always be around 100kPa (1 bar).

As far as I know, the baro sensor is integrated inside the PCM, not separate like MAP & MAF.

Gents, Should the MAP KPA rise higher than what's in the new pics when the Car is revved ?

When I start the car its almost 100KPA which I presume is normal, I've just took a video of the readings, ive hit almost 4500rpm sitting on my drive and its moved to about 103KPA. And on the road it almost 2000RPM and its 112KPA

I had the MAP replaced a few weeks ago, the MAP does not sit perfectly in the connection, it does not clip on, it fits and slides in but you can easily just pull it out, ive pushed it in and put a cable tie around it. Just checking the MAP is working as it should.

4 minutes ago, Orsm99 said:

Gents, Should the MAP KPA rise higher than what's in the new pics when the Car is revved ?

When I start the car its almost 100KPA which I presume is normal, I've just took a video of the readings, ive hit almost 4500rpm sitting on my drive and its moved to about 103KPA. And on the road it almost 2000RPM and its 112KPA

I had the MAP replaced a few weeks ago, the MAP does not sit perfectly in the connection, it does not clip on, it fits and slides in but you can easily just pull it out, ive pushed it in and put a cable tie around it. Just checking the MAP is working as it should.

You can rev the guts out of it with the car stationary and it will not hit its maximum but should be a lot more than 103kPa.

On the road at high load it should max out at just a shade under 250kPa briefly.

If your Turbo is not providing any Boost then the readings you are getting seem to be correct.

5 minutes ago, Tizer said:

You can rev the guts out of it with the car stationary and it will not hit its maximum but should be a lot more than 103kPa.

On the road at high load it should max out at just a shade under 250kPa briefly.

If your Turbo is not providing any Boost then the readings you are getting seem to be correct.

@Tizer Thank you, hopefully the turbo pressure solenoid that ive ordered sorts this turbo boost issue out.

Thanks again everyone :

On 7/29/2024 at 12:45 PM, Orsm99 said:

The VNTP% does not move and stays at 0.00, voltage shows 1.37 and hardly moves (1.37-1.39). Is this data for the turbo solenoid valve itself or for something else ?

Like Tom, I think the VNTP% is VNT Position, and is derived from the Voltage figure also in the list. The modest increase in MAP reading (98 to 129) with rpm could just be the turbo spinning up a bit with increased air flow despite no vane movement - On my 1.8, the MAP base reading starts to rise (up to about 1.2kPa), at above 2500RPM, even with fully closed throttle and vanes fully in the "no boost" position.

Have a good look through the available PIDs for a Duty Cycle (eg VNTDC or anything similar), which will be the output signal from the PCM to the solenoid. This would confirm if the PCM is asking the turbo to boost up, or if it has left the turbo in its "no boost" state due to other errors in the car, eg so called limp mode.

15 hours ago, Tdci-Peter said:

Like Tom, I think the VNTP% is VNT Position, and is derived from the Voltage figure also in the list. The modest increase in MAP reading (98 to 129) with rpm could just be the turbo spinning up a bit with increased air flow despite no vane movement - On my 1.8, the MAP base reading starts to rise (up to about 1.2kPa), at above 2500RPM, even with fully closed throttle and vanes fully in the "no boost" position.

Have a good look through the available PIDs for a Duty Cycle (eg VNTDC or anything similar), which will be the output signal from the PCM to the solenoid. This would confirm if the PCM is asking the turbo to boost up, or if it has left the turbo in its "no boost" state due to other errors in the car, eg so called limp mode.

Thanks, I will have a look, Car is back in the local garage. They changed the Turbo boost solenoid, it made no difference.

Can I just clarify something, With the two MAP KPA readings, The one thats always around 10 KPA, is that the voltage of the MAP ?

 

9 hours ago, Orsm99 said:

Can I just clarify something, With the two MAP KPA readings, The one thats always around 10 KPA, is that the voltage of the MAP ?

It can't be Voltage if the units are kPa. Normally Sensors work on a Voltage of 0 or 0.45 to 5 Volts.

If you click on it FORScan should give you more details and maybe let you change either the units or range although I suspect it is the MAP to a different scale i.e. 1/10th.

28 minutes ago, Tizer said:

It can't be Voltage if the units are kPa. Normally Sensors work on a Voltage of 0 or 0.45 to 5 Volts.

If you click on it FORScan should give you more details and maybe let you change either the units or range although I suspect it is the MAP to a different scale i.e. 1/10th.

Yep my bad, I spoke to my mechanic and he has tested the voltage range of the MAP and said its showing a 5 feed, he said the 10 KPA reading was the pressure reading. So MAP seems fine.

 

On 8/5/2024 at 10:21 AM, Tdci-Peter said:

Like Tom, I think the VNTP% is VNT Position, and is derived from the Voltage figure also in the list. The modest increase in MAP reading (98 to 129) with rpm could just be the turbo spinning up a bit with increased air flow despite no vane movement - On my 1.8, the MAP base reading starts to rise (up to about 1.2kPa), at above 2500RPM, even with fully closed throttle and vanes fully in the "no boost" position.

Have a good look through the available PIDs for a Duty Cycle (eg VNTDC or anything similar), which will be the output signal from the PCM to the solenoid. This would confirm if the PCM is asking the turbo to boost up, or if it has left the turbo in its "no boost" state due to other errors in the car, eg so called limp mode.

Right, I have had another look with live data and searched the PIDS for "duty cycle", This one come up  - EGRBPDC, % which says EGR Cooler Bypass valve Duty Cycle, This did not function or move in a 7 minute drive, in-fact I dont think any of the EGR PIDS I selected moved apart from the Voltage. I have added a screen shot. If anyone wants to take a look at the video of these and see what it says I can email it to you. Does this mean my EGR Valve is causing this ? I am now at a loss 😞

 

The EGR cooler bypass valve is separate to the EGR valve.  The EGR cooler is basically a tiny heat exchanger (radiator) that EGR gasses can be passed through either to cool them before they go back into the intake or for them to help warm up the coolant more quickly after a cold start.

When neither of those functions are required, the cooler is bypassed so the gasses don't go near the coolant at all.  It may not be used on every drive, and will depend on various temperatures.

The bypass valve has a plastic vacuum actuator with a thin rubber vac hose coming from it.  You could check that hose is still connected.  I think the EGR is down the back of the engine on these so you may need to use a mirror to assist depending on access space.

This is what the whole assembly looks like.  The EGR valve is at the right hand end with fully electronic control.  The cooler is the long silvery part on the left hand side.  And the cooler bypass actuator is the round black plastic part at the front.  That is where you should see a thin vacuum hose when it's fitted to the car.

2010 - 2015 FORD MONDEO 2.0 TDCI DIESEL EGR VALVE & COOLER 9671398180 | eBay

UPDATE !!!!!! - For those thats followed My other post which was engine malfunction service now & Limp mode with code P2263 (Turbo) and jumping in on this topic.

@TomsFocus @Tizer @Tdci-Peter @Phantom76 @F0CUE @unofix @ssmith93

 

So it is finally fixed. It turns out my garage that I take my cars to had somehow installed the inlet manifold wrong. If you remember my original post I said that they found a split seem in the inlet manifold when they did a smoke test. They fitted a new one took it out for a test drive and then said it had injector issues (1&4) which were all taken off and sent off to be cleaned and then replaced, then they said the ECU/PCM were throwing errors. Basically I took the car to them running and starting with no issues apart from the P2263, this issue only come on when I got to 70mph. They were stumped and said its likely the PCM wiring which Ford originally thought it could be. I took it away as a virtual non runner, it went into engine malfunction service now as soon as you started the car with limp mode, it was misfiring and had a load of different error codes. (Remember it never did this when I dropped it off to them)

Ford have now fixed it. Several months on from when the garage had it the DPF issues started, (Had error codes for can't regen) FORD had to replace the DPF Vaporiser and do a forced regen as the soot load was so high, they said they needed to do this so they could do a live test data run to see what's happening.  

I am expecting a call from the mechanic at Ford to explain what the issues were with the manifold. 

I now need to speak with the garage that fitted the manifold incorrectly and see what form of compensation they are willing to offer. It cost approximately 1k for the new inlet manifold, all injectors to be cleaned, and a new MAP&MAF sensors plus the Labour.

The cost at Ford was £1300, This was for a new DPF vaporiser, a forced Regen, and labour to do the DPF and take off and refit the inlet manifold.

I'm going to need my local garage to speak to Ford to either explain what they had to put right or some sort of letter. I don't want this to go down the small claims court route but it might have to if I dont get a settlement. I dont see why I should take it on the chin and accept the £1300 Ford bill.

I am no expert and this is a question for you guys, I am pretty sure all my original issues (P2263) engine malfunction service now and limp mode were caused by the split seam on the inlet manifold, if they had correctly fitted it I dont think I would have had injector issues, misfiring,  PCM/ECU codes, codes relating to the MAF/MAP - DPF being clogged and needing a forced regen.

Is it likely that the poorly fitted inlet manifold could of caused these issues.

Thanks again for everyone's help on this.

I'm glad you've finally got a resolution though sorry to hear it's taken so long.  I get incredibly frustrated with the arrogance of mechanics (and trades in general) when they have such a strong belief in their own work that they won't go back and recheck it even when different problems start immediately afterwards.

How long was the car driven in that state?  The DPF issues won't have happened quickly.  The vaporiser could have been broken by impacted soot from many miles without regen but that's a difficult one to prove.  The vaporisers break regularly anyway.  Once they have broken, the DPF won't regen so the soot load will just keep rising.

I don't think you needed the injectors, MAP or MAF, but again that could be difficult to prove now.  If it's just their word against yours I don't see that they'd give in and pay up tbh.

34 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

I'm glad you've finally got a resolution though sorry to hear it's taken so long.  I get incredibly frustrated with the arrogance of mechanics (and trades in general) when they have such a strong belief in their own work that they won't go back and recheck it even when different problems start immediately afterwards.

How long was the car driven in that state?  The DPF issues won't have happened quickly.  The vaporiser could have been broken by impacted soot from many miles without regen but that's a difficult one to prove.  The vaporisers break regularly anyway.  Once they have broken, the DPF won't regen so the soot load will just keep rising.

I don't think you needed the injectors, MAP or MAF, but again that could be difficult to prove now.  If it's just their word against yours I don't see that they'd give in and pay up tbh.

Thanks Tom,

The DPF error code saying it could not do a forced regen probably happened a few months after my local garage fitted the inlet manifold. I did not drive it much, only around the street roads where I live, maybe only 10/15 miles Max in the months leading up to the DPF error code. It was always in limp mode and could never get over 45/50mph. I never had any issues, lights, codes or warnings relating to the DPF before they touched it. 

I agree it's going to be a difficult one to prove and dont know how I could prove the poorly fitted inlet manifold caused the DPF vaporiser to fail, I guess I need to wait and speak to the ford mechanic to get their opinion. As you said they do break and go wrong but I have no idea of when that could of happened, one thing for sure is they messed up the job I paid them to do, so maybe at worst ask for the refund on the labour they charged to do the job and the labour Ford has charged to fix their poor work.

 

Short/slow/cold trips are the worst for creating exhaust soot.  Though I still don't think 10-15 miles of that could have clogged the DPF personally.  I reckon the loss of boost from the split inlet manifold had been clogging the DPF for weeks or months before the garage did anything to the car.  Again, that's not something we can prove either way though.

5 minutes ago, TomsFocus said:

Short/slow/cold trips are the worst for creating exhaust soot.  Though I still don't think 10-15 miles of that could have clogged the DPF personally.  I reckon the loss of boost from the split inlet manifold had been clogging the DPF for weeks or months before the garage did anything to the car.  Again, that's not something we can prove either way though.

Yep difficult to tell. Once I speak to the Ford Mechanic I will let you guys know what the issues were for the inlet manifold.

Thanks again