Possible wiring problem?

[LouCap]

Hi, 

I have a Ford Focus Zetec 1.8 Petrol 58 plate and up until last Wednesday it was perfect. On Wednesday morning, after I had started the engine and driven off (no problems), when I got to the end of the road I noticed that the steering had locked - I couldn't turn the wheel at all. Looking at the dials, the engine management light had come on, followed by the oil light and then the battery light. It was if the car had stalled but without coughing - the engine had completely cut out. Turning the engine off and on again solved the issue and I carried on with my day.

Come Wednesday lunch time the same thing happened again - only this time the engine wouldn't start. I waited about 5 mins before trying the start the car again and it worked. Took it to my local garage. 

The garage said they'd spoken to Ford's Technical garage and that it's a known fault. It's a wiring issue but they don't know which wire causes it (not sure if it's a different wire for each car), they've done a code read and found one or two but they couldn't find anything relating to my issue. They couldn't replicate it. Apparently, if they can find the fault, they can cut it out.

It happened again this morning.

Has anyone else experienced the same thing? Is there anything I can do to help fix the problem?

[Damien]

You check wiring to battery all ok no loose or any splits?

[LouCap]

1 hour ago, Damien said:

You check wiring to battery all ok no loose or any splits?

Yeah, everything is fine.

[Tdci-Peter]

6 hours ago, LouCap said:

the engine management light had come on

There will be some stored diagnostic code. Should be retained even if light goes out. Would like to know what codes the garage saw. Also maybe it needs more than just an OBD2 scanner (see below).

You have some options:

Go to a garage for a diagnostic readout. Free if they know you and are generous(?), up to £100 otherwise.

Find a mate with a scanner: Cost you a pint or equivalent maybe!

Get a generic OBD2 scanner. From about £10.00. I got a U480 off eBay, worked fine. Very easy to use, self contained, but limited capabilities.

Get a powerful Ford specific system. Cost £15.00 for the interface. Needs a computer of some sort. (COM port, USB, bluetooth or WiFi interfaces available). Not as simple as the self contained OBD2 scanner.

You will find a lot about ELM327 & Forscan on this site, which together provide a very comprehensive diagnosis & maintenance tool.

For ELM327 see:

http://www.spanglefish.com/TunnelratElectronics/index.asp?pageid=516992

One of these will pay for itself in no time.

you will also need a program called Forscan, its free and you can get it from

http://forscan.org/download.html

If you do this, post any results here, then someone may be able to help.

[LouCap]

3 hours ago, Tdci-Peter said:

There will be some stored diagnostic code. Should be retained even if light goes out. Would like to know what codes the garage saw. Also maybe it needs more than just an OBD2 scanner (see below).

You have some options:

Go to a garage for a diagnostic readout. Free if they know you and are generous(?), up to £100 otherwise.

Find a mate with a scanner: Cost you a pint or equivalent maybe!

Get a generic OBD2 scanner. From about £10.00. I got a U480 off Ebay, worked fine. Very easy to use, self contained, but limited capabilities.

Get a powerful Ford specific system. Cost £15.00 for the interface. Needs a computer of some sort. (COM port, USB, Bluetooth or WiFi interfaces available). Not as simple as the self contained OBD2 scanner.

You will find a lot about ELM327 & Forscan on this site, which together provide a very comprehensive diagnosis & maintenance tool.

For ELM327 see:

http://www.spanglefish.com/TunnelratElectronics/index.asp?pageid=516992

One of these will pay for itself in no time.

you will also need a program called Forscan, its free and you can get it from

http://forscan.org/download.html

If you do this, post any results here, then someone may be able to help.

The fault codes were U2510, P1260, P2121, P2122 and U1900. They said that the U1909 is always there, that Ford are aware and are not concerned. 

[Tdci-Peter]

U2510 & P1260 are: Communication error between the instrument cluster (IC) and the PCM

See: http://www.thaimazda3.com/svmanual/esicont/en/srvc/html/B3E090201077W12.html

P2121 & P2122 are to do with the throttle pedal sensor. But they are also linked to IC:

See: http://www.cmaxownersclub.co.uk/forum/technical-36/instrument-cluster-fault-54321/

U1900 can not entirely be ignored. While it is often caused by the use of diagnostic equipment (interfering with the bus), if it keeps occurring or is permanent, then it also indicates a CAN bus problem.

The PCM & IC are connected via the main CAN Bus. See some of my other posts for more background on this.

There is a simple resistance test that can be done to check for certain common faults on this bus:

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If CAN bus problem is suspected. Try simple resistance test:

There is no need to disconnect the battery. At least on my car the CAN bus went off about 30 sec after turning the ignition off. The PCM stays active for a while, I can hear it testing the EGR valve, and maybe doing other things, then it powers down and the bus goes dead. You can check with a voltmeter, CAN lines (6-14 in diagnostic connector) will be 1v to 3v when active, 0v when off.

Stick a couple of suitable probes (un-bent paper clips can work quite well) in the diagnostic connector pins 6-14, put a DMM across the pair on voltage range, turn ignition on, note reading, turn ignition off, wait till voltage drops to zero (+/- 1 or 2 mV), switch to resistance range to check for 60 ohms.

If 60 ohms, try tapping and moving various suspects, eg the fascia around the IC, the connector by the front door sill, the connector in the engine bay fuse box, and maybe the PCM. Look for any deviations. (IC = Instrument Cluster)

If not 60 ohms, disconnect the engine bay fuse box big connector, see if reading goes up. If it does, then IC is the fault, if not then PCM may be the fault. As both the PCM and the IC contain 120 ohm resistors between the two CAN lines, it is quite easy to detect whether all joints are intact at least up to these resistors. If both ends are linked together, the two 120 ohm resistors in parallel make 60 ohms.

This will not test other modules on the bus, nor internal faults in IC or PCM. A Ford specific diagnostic system is needed really for this. It will tell you if there is a wiring problem, or some simple faults on the IC or PCM. And a diagnostic system may not work at all, or work badly if there is a major CAN bus fault - It uses the bus.

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Do you have, or do you think you can get & use the Forscan system I described? It would help, and may be essential to effect a repair.

If the resistance test fails, indicating IC fault, I have made a pdf about a repair I did to my IC for this very problem. Cost was £0.00 (apart from £10 for the ELM). Hassle was massive, but I had no instructions to follow. See:

http://www.fordownersclub.com/forums/applications/core/interface/file/attachment.php?id=38633

But it is too early to jump to conclusions yet. BTW, check the battery voltage just in case, duff batteries have been known to cause electronic modules to behave oddly. See my posts in:

Bit to go on there, hope it is of help & not too confusing.

Please keep us posted here.