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smcc123

1.4 TDCi Ecu remap/ Intercooler

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I have a 2007 1.4 TDCi Fiesta and was thinking about getting it remapped. Its one of the slower models with only 68bhp. Found a company that says they can get it up to 100bhp. I saw another forum about the same model as mine talking about getting an intercooler then remapped to suit the intercooler. Would this do anything getting an intercooler on my car then getting it remapped to suit it and increase horsepower? The cars stock no turbo and i saw online that intercoolers wont do anything and are a waste of money without having a turbocharger. Might sound like a stupid question but would this help performance wise getting both done to my motor? Thanks.

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Theres a company called Hdi tuning which remap diesel engines made by Peugeot Citroën PSA. They say they up the power to 90hp and its within the stock hardware. Thinking of using them for my car. Also does your car have a turbo? 

http://www.hdi-tuning.co.uk/ecu-remapping/custom-remaps/ford-tuning/fiesta-mk6-1400-TDCI/fiesta-tuning-1-4-70-TDCI-remap.html

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i'm 99% certain your car does have a turbo on it, and referring zain611's message, in case you were not aware, the Fiesta 1.4tdci engine is a Peugeot engine. 

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TDCi = Turbo Diesel Common-rail Injection, so yes it will have a turbo. With the engine being so small though it might not have a factory fitted inter-cooler at all as it won't be compressing much air.

I suggest you learn at least the basic principles of how turbos and compressors work before you decide to start messing with it. A simple diagram showing where every pipe goes should do, and the basic principle that as air compresses it gets hot. Hot air is no good for an engine (a bit like you trying to breathe) so you use an inter-cooler to cool that compressed air down (like a radiator) so it gets a bigger bang in the engine.

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I am 99% certain the 1.4tdci of that era did not have an intercooler (the 1.6tdci 1560cc did have one). 

essentially, if we go back to a physics lesson - if you heat air up it expands and takes up more room. The turbo gets very hot and unfortunately heats the air up as the air goes through the turbo. The intercooler then cools the air back down while it travels between the turbo and the cylinders (where the pistons are). Because air takes up more room when hot and less room when cold, if you cool the air you can wedge more air into the cylinders. The air contains oxygen which is good for combustion of the fuel, so wedge more in there, you have got more oxygen in there to help with a big bang. 

But I have no idea what difference it makes to power percentage between have no intercooler and having an intercooler. The intercooler on my current 1.5tdci fiesta looks more restrictive than the intercooler on my 2007 1.6tdci fiesta.

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12 hours ago, Luke4efc said:

TDCi = Turbo Diesel Common-rail Injection, so yes it will have a turbo. With the engine being so small though it might not have a factory fitted inter-cooler at all as it won't be compressing much air.

The D is usually 'Direct' rather than diesel, common misconception... :smile:  

 

Adding an intercooler to a non-IC car is likely to just add more boost leaks - been there, done that! :laugh:  I used to own/work on a lot of 2.0 HDi's.  They left the factory with a GT15 turbo, no intercooler and a whopping 90bhp (yes, 90bhp from a 2.0!).  Just a stage 1 remap could take this up to 130bhp...and back in those days maps cost £50 and could be put on the car with a laptop and £10 cable...  Adding an intercooler on them could give you another 20bhp or so on top.  But would then ruin the clutch and the turbo would be at the edge of it's efficiency range.

In this case, I'd suggest trying a stage 1 remap alone before going to all the extra hassle of intercooler etc. :smile: 

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Sorry, got a bit mixed up. The car does have a turbo obviously as it is a TDCi, i meant i didn't install an aftermarket turbocharger. As you said isetta i dont think it has an intercooler built in. Saw a few fiesta zetecs out there that put an intercooler mounted to the front of the car and removed the front grill to fit it. Found this intercooler online for my make and model. Do you think i should go for it? If so before the remap?  http://www.fastrads.co.uk/intercoolers/ford/fiesta/diesel/1.4+tdci/index.html

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I don't think you'll need an intercooler for a stage 1 map. Mostly stage 1 maps are designed to be within the safe limits of the engine without having to change or add anything. Stage 2 maps then ask for supporting mods for example a free flow exhaust system, intercooler etc. The 1.6 TDCI engine has a front mounted intercooler so those zetec / zetec s models you saw may of had that engine rather than the 1.4 TDCI. 

1 hour ago, TomsFocus said:

The D is usually 'Direct' rather than diesel, common misconception... :smile:  

 

Adding an intercooler to a non-IC car is likely to just add more boost leaks - been there, done that! :laugh:  I used to own/work on a lot of 2.0 HDi's.  They left the factory with a GT15 turbo, no intercooler and a whopping 90bhp (yes, 90bhp from a 2.0!).  Just a stage 1 remap could take this up to 130bhp...and back in those days maps cost £50 and could be put on the car with a laptop and £10 cable...  Adding an intercooler on them could give you another 20bhp or so on top.  But would then ruin the clutch and the turbo would be at the edge of it's efficiency range.

In this case, I'd suggest trying a stage 1 remap alone before going to all the extra hassle of intercooler etc. :smile: 

I wonder why Peugeot made those 2 litres with little power. That's the same horsepower as my 1.6 tdci which is also made by them. Only positives I can see to get the 2 litre as apposed to the 1.6 is you can get more power out of it from a map. 

Also what benefits would installing a larger intercooler do? Is there any advantages or disadvantages? I'd love to install a airtec or focus RS intercooler on my car and expose it but they are expensive from £150 - 300

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55 minutes ago, zain611 said:

I wonder why Peugeot made those 2 litres with little power. That's the same horsepower as my 1.6 tdci which is also made by them. Only positives I can see to get the 2 litre as apposed to the 1.6 is you can get more power out of it from a map. 

Also what benefits would installing a larger intercooler do? Is there any advantages or disadvantages? I'd love to install a airtec or focus RS intercooler on my car and expose it but they are expensive from £150 - 300

You have to remember diesel engine tech moved on very quickly in the late 90s/early 2000s.  The 2.0 HDi was the first of the common rail diesels Peugeot produced, first diesel with an ECU even, they'd all been mechanical before then so buyers would have been very sceptical, as buyers of small petrol turbos were a couple years ago, and buyers of electric cars are now, people don't like change.  So PSA couldn't make the engine any smaller than their old diesels because of badge snobbery at the time...  'Eurgh, a 1.6 in a family car, no way!' :rolleyes:  But also couldn't make the power any higher as it'd rival the petrol sports models...not gonna sell many 2.0 petrols when they have the same power but half the MPG lol!  The engine was easily capable of a reliable 120bhp even within emissions regs at the time, it was restricted on purpose as it was meant to be equivalent to the 1.6 petrol with 90bhp.  

The 1.6 has a much more modern ECU, turbo and injectors, even that's restricted in power, but more for emissions reasons these days.

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"Also what benefits would installing a larger intercooler do? Is there any advantages or disadvantages? I'd love to install a airtec or focus RS intercooler on my car and expose it but they are expensive from £150 - 300"

I don't know if any benefit would be noticeable or not.  In theory an intercooler fights back against the turbo. The turbo is pressurising the air to force it into the engine.  As mentioned above, the intercooler cools the air back down, but the fact that the air has to travel through narrow channels in the intercooler means the intercooler must restrict the airflow between the turbo and the engine. Hence a larger intercooler with larger channels within would not restrict the airflow so much.

But |I don't know if you would notice or if these pricey replacement intercoolers just make you think your car will go faster when it does not.

If you compare the intercooler on a car like Zain611's mk6.5 1.6tdci (goes across the car inbetween the radiator and the radiator grill) to the intercooler on my mk7.5 1.5tdci it gives the impression visually that mine would be more restrictive on the airflow. Mine is beside the coolant radiator and has the inlet and outlet at the top next to eachother with sharp bends in and out. Just  looks like it would hinder the airflow more than on a mk6.5.

But I tend to think if you add an intercooler to the 1.4tdci and do nothing else, you won't notice a difference

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1 hour ago, isetta said:
1 hour ago, isetta said:

I don't know if any benefit would be noticeable or not.  In theory an intercooler fights back against the turbo. The turbo is pressurising the air to force it into the engine.  As mentioned above, the intercooler cools the air back down, but the fact that the air has to travel through narrow channels in the intercooler means the intercooler must restrict the airflow between the turbo and the engine. Hence a larger intercooler with larger channels within would not restrict the airflow so much.

But |I don't know if you would notice or if these pricey replacement intercoolers just make you think your car will go faster when it does not.

If you compare the intercooler on a car like Zain611's mk6.5 1.6tdci (goes across the car inbetween the radiator and the radiator grill) to the intercooler on my mk7.5 1.5tdci it gives the impression visually that mine would be more restrictive on the airflow. Mine is beside the coolant radiator and has the inlet and outlet at the top next to eachother with sharp bends in and out. Just  looks like it would hinder the airflow more than on a mk6.5.

But I tend to think if you add an intercooler to the 1.4tdci and do nothing else, you won't notice a difference

But i thought the point was that the inter cooler cools the air coming in and with cold air being more dense than warm air its more efficient and therefore allows better performance. Yes, it may be more restrictive but its restrictive for a reason, to cool the warm air. Still unsure if i should get it or not. I know zain611 said how its usually only stage 2 you would add things like intercoolers but i have seen some guys who've added an intercooler to suit their stage 1 remap.

 

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