MONDEO MK4 TITANIUM X 1.8TDCi REFURB STUFF

[Routy56]

Evening guys, 

so I took on this car some time ago to 'get back on the road' after my son-in-law broke down in it.

It had a long list of things that needed doing and he was going to simply scrap it 😬

Far too good to scrap and knowing my way around a box of spanners I took it on as a project.....

So far have done the basics:

• Cambelt and water pump replaced
• Auxillary belt replaced (this caused the breakdown)
• Crankshaft seal replaced (this caused the auxiliary belt to let go)
• Crankshaft pulley replaced
• All 4 wheels refurbished
• All 4 tyres replaced
• Air conditioning condensor replaced
• All 4 injectors replaced with the XXXX02 batch code (another story for later)🙄
• All 4 glow plugs replaced

So, having done all this work, there is some more fettling to be done before I present it for an MOT test

AND, will be asking you guys for advice based on your own experience with this model 🥸

So TODAY'S QUESTION is:

The old glow plugs were ALL open circuit.

Having replaced the 4 glow plugs, with nice new ones, I noticed that they were permanently ON with the engine running 😬

When starting they should be energised for 5-10 seconds.

Correct operation occurred with I simply pushed the START button without depressing the clutch.

Not wishing to 'burn out' my new glow plugs I pulled the relay out for now.....

Q - "What is causing my glow plugs to remain ON?"

[nicam49]

Hi, well done, btw! Nice to keep the oldies but goodies on the road. Re the GPs. I can only speak about the mk3, and on that, although the GP light on the dash stays on for 5-10 secs, the actual GPs are energised for 30 secs. This is to reduce the smoke/emissions on startup rather than assist cold starting, which was the traditional reason for GPs. In fact you'll find the car starts quite easily without the GP fuse in place. So, I'd say IF the GPs stay energised for longer than 45 secs, (say,) you've def got an issue. I used a test light with croc clips to visually test if the GPs are getting volts.

 

[FatHead1979]

@Routy56I've seen the glow plugs on my MK2 Focus 1.8 TDCi stay energised for 2-3 minutes, especially when it's the 1st start of the day in cold weather.

 

If the glow plugs are still energised after 5 minutes, I'd expect that something is wrong somewhere.

[Routy56]

13 hours ago, nicam49 said:

Hi, well done, btw! Nice to keep the oldies but goodies on the road. Re the GPs. I can only speak about the mk3, and on that, although the GP light on the dash stays on for 5-10 secs, the actual GPs are energised for 30 secs. This is to reduce the smoke/emissions on startup rather than assist cold starting, which was the traditional reason for GPs. In fact you'll find the car starts quite easily without the GP fuse in place. So, I'd say IF the GPs stay energised for longer than 45 secs, (say,) you've def got an issue. I used a test light with croc clips to visually test if the GPs are getting volts.

 

Thanks for your reply confirming what I suspect. Yes it’s exactly that and I too tested with a simple test lamp while starting up. It doesn’t go out 😳

so just need to understand what turns the relay on and off etc 🥸

[Routy56]

13 hours ago, FatHead1979 said:

@Routy56I've seen the glow plugs on my MK2 Focus 1.8 TDCi stay energised for 2-3 minutes, especially when it's the 1st start of the day in cold weather.

 

If the glow plugs are still energised after 5 minutes, I'd expect that something is wrong somewhere.

Thanks for your reply 👍🏻

And yes they are staying energised so we have a problem 😳

Further investigation and a schematic diagram would be useful 🤓

[nicam49]

Could be that the gp relay contacts are fused together...you'll need to locate it and remove it to check with a meter or by substitution.

Here's a link to fusebox info, tho'  can't say how accurate it is...

https://www.fordwiki.co.uk/index.php/Fuse_%26_Relay_Information_-_Mk4

 

btw, worth investing in a Haynes manual esp. if you intended keeping the mk4. I bought a 2nd hand one for my mk6 Fiesta, posted for less than a tenner.

[Routy56]

4 hours ago, nicam49 said:

Could be that the gp relay contacts are fused together...you'll need to locate it and remove it to check with a meter or by substitution.

Here's a link to fusebox info, tho'  can't say how accurate it is...

https://www.fordwiki.co.uk/index.php/Fuse_%26_Relay_Information_-_Mk4

 

btw, worth investing in a Haynes manual esp. if you intended keeping the mk4. I bought a 2nd hand one for my mk6 Fiesta, posted for less than a tenner.

Hi Nick, I wish it was something as simple as 'fused contacts'!
The relay IS WORKING because it powers up the glow plugs for 5-10s with ignition on and car not started.

That is, a single push on the start button.

Just need to understand how the relay is controlled ......🥸

And yes, I have a Haynes for the car but it lacks detail 🙄

[nicam49]

Hang on,! In your original post you said the GPs should be on for 5-10secs (which I doubted -said they shld be on for MUCH longer than the symbol on the dashboard, in my car's case it's 30 secs) the GP symbol on the  dash doubles as a self-test indicator on switch on. Now you're saying in your last post they turn on for 5-10 seconds anyway....

(Ignore the GP symbol on the dash for now...)

 

 

[Routy56]

39 minutes ago, nicam49 said:

Hang on,! In your original post you said the GPs should be on for 5-10secs (which I doubted -said they shld be on for MUCH longer than the symbol on the dashboard, in my car's case it's 30 secs) the GP symbol on the  dash doubles as a self-test indicator on switch on. Now you're saying in your last post they turn on for 5-10 seconds anyway....

(Ignore the GP symbol on the dash for now...)

 

 

Hey Nick, yep they stay on!

I first noticed a problem after the engine had been running in the workshop for about 10 mins. There was smoke coming from a dodgy connection on the main supply cable 😳

This has now been repaired and on investigation I found that they were staying on - as confirmed by my test lamp 🥸

And yes I’d be happy if they stayed on for up to 30s but it’s not happening.

So how is the GP relay controlled? 
I suspect that it’s controlled by the PCM module and dependant on ambient temperature 😉

[nicam49]

Hi, so,  I just need you to clarify something for me. If you connect your test lamp to the glowplug busbar, and turn on the ignition (but don't necessarily start the engine) does the lamp light up for more than 2 minutes? And btw, the coil symbol on the dash is NOT an indication of the glowplugs being energised! It has a dual-purpose, when you 1st turn on the ignition it is a self-test indicator, and afterwards it flashes if the ECU logs a fault code condition. Do NOT confuse it with the GPs being switched on.

 

[Routy56]

15 hours ago, nicam49 said:

Hi, so,  I just need you to clarify something for me. If you connect your test lamp to the glowplug busbar, and turn on the ignition (but don't necessarily start the engine) does the lamp light up for more than 2 minutes? And btw, the coil symbol on the dash is NOT an indication of the glowplugs being energised! It has a dual-purpose, when you 1st turn on the ignition it is a self-test indicator, and afterwards it flashes if the ECU logs a fault code condition. Do NOT confuse it with the GPs being switched on.

 

Hi Nick, yep understand how they work and how to test with a test lamp etc (and even a voltmeter and/or oscilloscope). And understand about the dash indicator lamp etc (in this case it is not displayed)

AND when running the FORscan application software there is a:

"P0670 - Glow Plug Module Control" DTC (amongst others)

So will now focus my attention on the Glow Plug Module Control DTC issue.

Do you or anyone else have experience of dealing with this issue on this model of car please?

And I will repeat my original question:

Q - "What is causing my glow plugs to remain ON?"

 

 

[Routy56]

SOLVED - GLOW PLUG FUNCTION ISSUE 😃

So have just spent some time with FORscan and the test lamp on the old Mondeo.

 

AND have cleared the P0670 DTC which may have caused my perception of a problem.

Normal function is this:

Starting from cold (about 8c) the GP stay on for about 2mins 50 secs

Starting from warm (about 60c) the GP say on for about 1min 40 secs

The conclusion is that 'normal function' is dependant on engine temperature.

And may be effected by the DTC triggered by the old open circuit Glow Plugs 

So, in conclusion, when you change yer glow plugs I recommend that you check and clear the P0670 DTC 🥸

 

[Routy56]

DIY refurb of the wheels was easy - just a bit of elbow grease before new tyres 😉

Rubbed down and primed

Rattle can silver wheel paint and lacquer gives nice used car finish 🥸

Then over my brother's workshop for new tyres and balance job 🥰

The new wheels and tyres look good even after a few months outside 😎

 

 

[Routy56]

Radiator was leaking slightly so, new radiator was ordered from Car Parts in Motion - a bargain at only £52.73

 

Then the air con had stopped working so a new condenser was order from Car Spares Direct - another bargain at only £52

The two were clipped together and slipped in from underneath

 

New thermostat housing was obtained. The old one was weeping. They do that 

[Marty71]

Nice job well done for saving it, I've the same car with 427,000 km on the clock and just tested for another year, hopefully I'll keep mine for another 10 years 🙂

 

[Routy56]

9 hours ago, Marty71 said:

Nice job well done for saving it, I've the same car with 427,000 km on the clock and just tested for another year, hopefully I'll keep mine for another 10 years 🙂

 

Thanks for replying Martin. Nice to know that I’m not alone 😊

This car has about 173k on the clock and I plan to get it back on the road in the Spring. A I say more of a project car and far too good to scrap.

There’s a few more things to be done:

Front suspension strut top bearings are noisy. May replace the struts and springs to make a proper fix 😉

Carry on the investigation into the misfire at about 1500rpm.

There is a know issue with the Siemens 4M5Q9F593AD fuel injectors  fitted to Lynx engine. I have now replaced them 3 times with various second hand, tested and reconditioned units 😳

This well may be the topic of a separate posting…..

[Marty71]

I've replaced no 2 injector twice and also a leaky return pipe and over the last year I've replaced rear bushings and control arms and also sprayed the rear subframe with anti rust paint and a few other little bits but nothing major, don't do big miles now and nice car to drive so hopefully nothing major goes wrong.

Best of luck with it I'll be keeping an eye on your progress nice to see older cars saved and looked after 👍