Why is it important to count the number of turns when removing and replacing track rod ends ?

[Fastlife91]

I am a novice at the moment when it comes to repairing cars but I would love to fix more parts on my car. I have a manual and access to a tool set. I want to tackle the job myself.

I have watched many tutorials on how to replace them and they say to count how many turns it takes to remove the track rod ends as it helps keep the car in better alignment once the new part is on. 
My question is, is it still important to count the number of turns when removing the track rod ends if I am going to take it to a garage to get the alignment done straight after ?

Does the number of track rod ends turns have a part to play even as well as getting the tracking done to ensure the steering is straight ?


thanks

[Russ]

47 minutes ago, Fastlife91 said:

I am a novice at the moment when it comes to repairing cars but I would love to fix more parts on my car. I have a manual and access to a tool set. I want to tackle the job myself.
I have watched many tutorials on how to replace them and they say to count how many turns it takes to remove the track rod ends as it helps keep the car in better alignment once the new part is on. 
My question is, is it still important to count the number of turns when removing the track rod ends if I am going to take it to a garage to get the alignment done straight after ?
Does the number of track rod ends turns have a part to play even as well as getting the tracking done to ensure the steering is straight ?
thanks

This should explain everything .....   http://www.howacarworks.com/steering/replacing-track-rod-end-ball-joints

[TomsFocus]

Better to measure the distance between the nut and the centre of the ball - different brands are slightly different around the ball area so counting threads doesn't often work in my experience.

[Bobr]

Regardless of which way you do it , you must get the tracking checked as soon as possible after.

[Fastlife91]

6 hours ago, Fastlife91 said:

I am a novice at the moment when it comes to repairing cars but I would love to fix more parts on my car. I have a manual and access to a tool set. I want to tackle the job myself.

I have watched many tutorials on how to replace them and they say to count how many turns it takes to remove the track rod ends as it helps keep the car in better alignment once the new part is on. 
My question is, is it still important to count the number of turns when removing the track rod ends if I am going to take it to a garage to get the alignment done straight after ?

Does the number of track rod ends turns have a part to play even as well as getting the tracking done to ensure the steering is straight ?


thanks

 

6 hours ago, Russ said:

This should explain everything .....   http://www.howacarworks.com/steering/replacing-track-rod-end-ball-joints

 

4 hours ago, TomsFocus said:

Better to measure the distance between the nut and the centre of the ball - different brands are slightly different around the ball area so counting threads doesn't often work in my experience.

 

4 hours ago, Bobr said:

Regardless of which way you do it , you must get the tracking checked as soon as possible after.

Not being rude, thank you all for replying but nobody has answered the question in the thread title.

 

I'm asking does it matter if I don't count the number of turns and/or measure the distance  when removing the track rod end if I am going to get the tracking done right after the replacement or not ?

[iantt]

doesnt matter , but it needs to be sonewhere near the same , depending on how far you are going to get the tracking done, way out and your tyres will be scrap after a few short miles

[Fastlife91]

3 hours ago, Fastlife91 said:

 

 

 

Not being rude, thank you all for replying but nobody has answered the question in the thread title.

 

I'm asking does it matter if I don't count the number of turns and/or measure the distance  when removing the track rod end if I am going to get the tracking done right after the replacement or not ?

Great, thanks for the help.

So all the commotion in the tutorials about having to count the number of turns to remove and replace the track rod end is just as a temporary measure until one gets to a garage to have the car tracked/ wheels aligned ?  so if I did not count how many turns it took to remove the track rod ends and reinstall by said turns, will my wheel alignment still be out after getting the car tracked at the shop because I did not count the turns and measure the distance or will it be okay after getting it tracked at the garage ?

 

also what is meant by having to check the new track rods and ends are the same length ? 

 

 

thanks

[simcor]

AreYou have been told by counting the turns or measuring them or backing off the lock nut one turn you can put the replacements in approx the right position without the tracking being way out. But it still needs tracking adjusting as soon as possible.

A few miles with badly out if spec tracking will start to scrub the tyres either on the inside or outside edges.

It will also affect the handling especially in the wet if the wheels are not pointing straight ahead, especially so if one is more or less straight and the other is at an angle pointing in or out.

It is best practise to adjust them as close as you can when fitting them. Then when you have it aligned they will align both wheels correctly with the laser wheel tracking machine.

For checking the length of the new ones that is purely to see that they are the approx same length as some makes vary in the design and as always they should be replaced in pairs.

Remember working on your own car is important to get it right as you are putting your life and others on the line. In the event of an accident you would be to blame if they inspect the vehicle and find work to be sub standard.

Everyone has to learn to a degree but asking the amount of questions you do makes me worry you don't know enough about what you are trying to do, read the Haynes and it will tell what is required to do jobs, if you don't understand it then maybe you should take it to someone who does know what they are doing.

 

[Fastlife91]

12 hours ago, simcor said:

AreYou have been told by counting the turns or measuring them or backing off the lock nut one turn you can put the replacements in approx the right position without the tracking being way out. But it still needs tracking adjusting as soon as possible.

A few miles with badly out if spec tracking will start to scrub the tyres either on the inside or outside edges.

It will also affect the handling especially in the wet if the wheels are not pointing straight ahead, especially so if one is more or less straight and the other is at an angle pointing in or out.

It is best practise to adjust them as close as you can when fitting them. Then when you have it aligned they will align both wheels correctly with the laser wheel tracking machine.

For checking the length of the new ones that is purely to see that they are the approx same length as some makes vary in the design and as always they should be replaced in pairs.

Remember working on your own car is important to get it right as you are putting your life and others on the line. In the event of an accident you would be to blame if they inspect the vehicle and find work to be sub standard.

Everyone has to learn to a degree but asking the amount of questions you do makes me worry you don't know enough about what you are trying to do, read the Haynes and it will tell what is required to do jobs, if you don't understand it then maybe you should take it to someone who does know what they are doing.

 

Thank you brother for taking the time to reply to me.

 

A. I will be replacing the track rod itself too so would I need to screw it on as far onto the new thread of the new track rod as it was on the old one ?

B. I get that

C. Is it better to get tracking done on a computer or by laser technique ?

D. I still don't get it ??    Why would it matter if  new track rod ends are longer or shorter than  the current ones ?   They wrere only replace in Decmber but need doing again. ever since they got done last time and after getting tracking done it has had a steering wheel pull since

E.  The Haynes manual does not seem to help at all,  gives 3 instructions and that is all !  video tutorials such as on YouTube are of more help

[simcor]

10 hours ago, Fastlife91 said:

Thank you brother for taking the time to reply to me.

 

A. I will be replacing the track rod itself too so would I need to screw it on as far onto the new thread of the new track rod as it was on the old one ?

B. I get that

C. Is it better to get tracking done on a computer or by laser technique ?

D. I still don't get it ??    Why would it matter if  new track rod ends are longer or shorter than  the current ones ?   They wrere only replace in Decmber but need doing again. ever since they got done last time and after getting tracking done it has had a steering wheel pull since

E.  The Haynes manual does not seem to help at all,  gives 3 instructions and that is all !  video tutorials such as on YouTube are of more help

A. both track rods and track rod ends need to be the correct lengths. if they are different lengths they will put the tracking out that is why you check them to make sure they are correct. It also helps you make sure they are both the right items as they may look the same but orders can be picked incorrectly.

C. I have never heard of laser vs computer tracking, AFAIK there is 2 wheel laser adjustment or 4 wheel laser adjustment. 2 wheel tracking adjusts the front wheels tracking which is very old hat now. 4 wheel alignment uses the same laser principle but allows the whole geometry of the front and rear suspension to be set correctly as close to the manufacturers specifications. Some vehicles can be adjusted on the back suspension. Having the front tracked does not mean the front wheels will be perfectly aligned with the rears still causing wear to tyres. 4 wheel alignment means all 4 wheels will be pointing straight ahead as far as is possible and stop any handling issues, all 4 wheels need to be aligned properly in this day and age.

D. If new TRE's are longer then they will be longer so pushing the wheels out at an angle more putting the tracking out even more, so they should be screwed on to be about the same length which would involve making sure the distance is about the same by however many turns to make them approx the same length.

[Fastlife91]

On ‎18‎/‎07‎/‎2016 at 10:27 AM, simcor said:

A. both track rods and track rod ends need to be the correct lengths. if they are different lengths they will put the tracking out that is why you check them to make sure they are correct. It also helps you make sure they are both the right items as they may look the same but orders can be picked incorrectly.

C. I have never heard of laser vs computer tracking, AFAIK there is 2 wheel laser adjustment or 4 wheel laser adjustment. 2 wheel tracking adjusts the front wheels tracking which is very old hat now. 4 wheel alignment uses the same laser principle but allows the whole geometry of the front and rear suspension to be set correctly as close to the manufacturers specifications. Some vehicles can be adjusted on the back suspension. Having the front tracked does not mean the front wheels will be perfectly aligned with the rears still causing wear to tyres. 4 wheel alignment means all 4 wheels will be pointing straight ahead as far as is possible and stop any handling issues, all 4 wheels need to be aligned properly in this day and age.

D. If new TRE's are longer then they will be longer so pushing the wheels out at an angle more putting the tracking out even more, so they should be screwed on to be about the same length which would involve making sure the distance is about the same by however many turns to make them approx the same length.

A. Okay, got it, so I will buy the track rods and ends from same shop as last time in the hope they will give me the same part type. (though a friend said these parts must be crap because they failed already after 5 months ) I don't get how they are different sized though ?    how come they are not all the same size anyway ?

If they are different lengths , could it still put the car's tracking out after the car has been tracked at a garage ?

B. Me neither until I popped by a tracking shop the other day to speak to them there and they told me they only use computer tracking which is supposed to be very good and affective.

I am going to fit the tie rods and track rod ends myself but I am a bit worried that I may not tighten them 100 % correctly.  as I will be getting the tracking done at a shop afterward would they be cool if I asked them to make sure I fitted the track rods and track rod ends on correctly ?

 

[stef123]

If you've got doubts about fitting them I suggest you just pay a garage an hours labour and have them done properly. 

[Russ]

Is this still ongoing? Once and for all you have two choices....1/ slacken the old ones and count the number of turns, put the new ones on to the same number of turns then go and get it tracked immediately. 

2/ take it to a garage and just get them to do it!