Confusing Codes!

[Lewie]

Hi all

Focus 1.6 Tdci 2008.

Engine Malfunction light on

Used Forscan and got many codes.

I’ve looked them up but as there’s many I’m wondering if there is a central issue?

I’ve pasted all that Forscan found, sorry about the amount of text but I’m not sure what is helpful and what isn’t.

One thing, it says the fuel additive tank is low.

I put a litre in less than a year ago so I can’t see that it can be low?

I’m confused! If you fall asleep before reading it all I’ll understand. 🙂

===PCM DTC P1622-21===
Code: P1622 - Immobilizer ID Does Not Match

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - Signal is Above Maximum Threshold

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Immobilizer ID Does Not Match

===END PCM DTC P1622-21===

===PCM DTC P1936-24===
Code: P1936 - Clutch switch input circuit malfunction

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - There is no change in the signal

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Clutch Switch/Sensor Signal

===END PCM DTC P1936-24===

===PCM DTC P193B-24===
Code: P193B - Throttle/Pedal Signal

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - There is no change in the signal

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

APP Signal

APPS1 fault.

The CAN message from the cluster is missing.

The PCM receives APPS1 signal over the CAN network.

This DTC may be caused by :

CAN communication bus fault.

Faulty APPS circuit.

Faulty APP Sensor

Wiring / Connectors

Faulty or damaged PCM.

===END PCM DTC P193B-24===

===PCM DTC P1935-24===
Code: P1935 - Brake Switch/Sensor Signal

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - There is no change in the signal

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Brake Switch/Sensor Signal

This DTC may be caused by :

Faulty Sensor

Wiring Harness Short to battery or Short to Ground

Damaged or contaminated connector

Faulty or damaged PCM.

===END PCM DTC P1935-24===

===PCM DTC U0416-28===
Code: U0416 - Invalid Data Received from the ABS Control Module

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - Invalid Signal

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Invalid Data Received from the ABS Control Module

===END PCM DTC U0416-28===

===PCM DTC P2002-21===
Code: P2002 - Particle Filter Efficiency Below Threshold

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - Signal is Above Maximum Threshold

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Particulate Trap Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1)

This DTC may be caused by :

Absense Of Particle Filter

Delta Pressure Sensor Hoses Incorrectly Fitted Or Damaged

Restriction/blockage in air intake system.

Check the following:

Check that the differential pressure sensor and hoses are intact and not blocked.

Check The Filter Is Fitted

===END PCM DTC P2002-21===

===PCM DTC P2585-21===
Code: P2585 - Fuel Additive Control Module Warning Lamp Request

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - Signal is Above Maximum Threshold

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Fuel Additive Control Module Warning Lamp Request

===END PCM DTC P2585-21===

===FACM DTC P1932-60===
Code: P1932 - Fuel Additive Level Low

Status: 
 - DTC Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Fuel Additive Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Fuel Additive Level Low

If DTC P1927 is present, resolve it before continuing.

This DTC illuminates the PCL.

This DTC may be caused by :

fuel additive tank empty or additive level too low

visually check the additive level by illuminating the tank from the side

Refill the FAT if necessary.

CAUTION: Always refill the FAT in accordance with the workshop manual instructions and then carry out the "Refill the Fuel Additive Tank" service function.

Make sure that DTCs are cleared from both FACM and PCM after repairs are completed.

===END FACM DTC P1932-60===

===ABS DTC None===
Successful DTC reading, no error codes found

Module: Antilock braking system

===END ABS DTC None===

===EPS DTC U1900-20===
Code: U1900 - Missing Message for Engine Speed

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Electronic-Controlled Power Steering

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

CAN Communication Bus Fault (missing messages)

Possible causes are:

Missing Message for Engine Speed

Engine RPM Data Invalid

Vehicle Speed Data Invalid

Check CAN Wiring/CAN Network is functioning.

Note:

DTCs that start with 'U' are faults which occur during module-to-module communication.

Modules should never be replaced based only on a 'U' code. These codes do not always indicate a problem, and can be caused by normal diagnostic functions, carried out on the vehicle.

===END EPS DTC U1900-20===

===IC DTC None===
Successful DTC reading, no error codes found

Module: Instrument Cluster

===END IC DTC None===

===RCM DTC None===
Successful DTC reading, no error codes found

Module: Restraint Control Module

===END RCM DTC None===

===ACM DTC None===
Successful DTC reading, no error codes found

Module: Audio Control Module

===END ACM DTC None===

===GEM DTC None===
Successful DTC reading, no error codes found

Module: Generic Electronic Module

===END GEM DTC None===

[TomsFocus]

Are they all fresh codes?  If you clear them, which ones come back?

It looks like there is a GEM or cluster issue tbh.  But the one there that's likely to cause a dash warning is the Eolys fluid being low.  Shouldn't have used a litre in a year really but maybe it's overdosing for some reason.

[Tdci-Peter]

9 hours ago, Lewie said:

Used Forscan and got many codes.

I’ve looked them up but as there’s many I’m wondering if there is a central issue?

I can't see a simple common cause, unfortunately. But CAN bus communication is implicated.

The Clutch, Brake and APPS1 signals all connect to the IC, and this then sends the data to the PCM over the HS CAN bus. The immobiliser (PATS) sensor connects to the IC, and part of the key verification takes place in the IC. So the IC and bus are strongly suspected here.

Some of the other errors are also CAN bus related. "Invalid Data Received from the ABS Control Module"  is over the bus, as is "Missing Message for Engine Speed".

But the DPF DP sensor connects direct to the PCM, which is where the error is. And the Additive level error is in the FACM, as expected.

Like Tom says, clear the codes and see what returns. Try bashing the fascia around the IC to see if that makes any of the CAN bus errors return. Bad connections on the IC are quite common.

Was the FACM reset properly after the additive fill? As far as I know, it has no real level sensor, it just guesses level based on doses put in to the tank, and has to be told when it is full. It is a very poor system, really.

The DPF blockage error is potentially more serious. If it is not the sensor hoses or sensor, then it could be that either it has not been getting enough Eolys at some time, and is blocked by soot, or it has done too many miles and is blocked by ash. Soot can sometimes be burnt off in a regen, but ash can not be burnt at all.

[Lewie]

Hi both.

Thanks for the replies.

Glad I came back and checked as the 'Notify me of replies' option hasn't worked.
How long does it take for the codes to return? Edit: Just been out to the car, pressed the 'clear all codes' then reconnected, all came back. Have I done this right?
Can I visually see if the additive tank is empty? Edit: The tank is solid black so I'm guessing there is no way of 'seeing' the level? Brilliant design!!

One other thing, can all errors make the engine malfunction light come on?

Cheers
Mods, can someone sort the notification issue? Ta

[Tdci-Peter]

3 hours ago, Lewie said:

pressed the 'clear all codes' then reconnected, all came back. Have I done this right?
Can I visually see if the additive tank is empty? Edit: The tank is solid black so I'm guessing there is no way of 'seeing' the level? Brilliant design!!

One other thing, can all errors make the engine malfunction light come on?

I usually re-scan for codes (the Icon at the bottom near the clear codes icon) immediately after clearing, before a disconnect or ignition cycle. Then I can check it has worked. With the engine not running, very few codes should re-appear. I would think it unlikely that all those codes would re-appear straight away, so maybe it did not clear them. In Forscan, it says something about "clear codes for the selected module(s)" when you press the clear button. Try selecting each module with codes in in turn, and clearing individually.

What makes the MIL come on is a bit of a mystery. Some codes require 2 occurances, some never light it, some light it, but do not re-light it after an ignition off cycle, some stay active for ages. It kind of depends on the severity of the fault, but like all modern things, there is not much real logic to it once you start looking hard!

Yeah, the detail design of that additive system was a complete disaster. It has caused no end of problems for owners. Loads of threads about additive problems on this site.

[Lewie]

Thanks for the reply Peter.

Yes, I've seen the individual options to clear codes.
I'll have another go.
I blasted the car for about 30 minutes or so yesterday. I drove it in lower gears keeping the revs around 3,000-4.000.
My attempt to clear the DPF.
It was quite amusing watching peoples faces as I drove past.
Not sure if it changed anything but I'm sure the engine malfunction came on when I turned the ignition to on.
Now it doesn't light until I start the car. Or am I dreaming? 

[Lewie]

Attempted to clear all codes by choosing individual options.

All come back as no error codes except for the FACM P1932-60 Fuel additive level low

Now, what I don't get is as there is no actual sensor to activate the low level warning how come I'm getting this error?
As I stated above, I added a litre a year or so ago and haven't been more than 8,000 miles since.
i must have reset the error last time as it's taken a year to return. Surely if I didn't reset it last time it would have come back pretty much right away?
Even if there was a leak in the tank and it was completely empty, if there is no sensor how would it know?

Confused? Oh yes sir I am.

[Tdci-Peter]

6 hours ago, Lewie said:

Now, what I don't get is as there is no actual sensor to activate the low level warning how come I'm getting this error?
As I stated above, I added a litre a year or so ago and haven't been more than 8,000 miles since.
i must have reset the error last time as it's taken a year to return. Surely if I didn't reset it last time it would have come back pretty much right away?
Even if there was a leak in the tank and it was completely empty, if there is no sensor how would it know?

The way the software works (?) on the 1.6TDCI is even more confusing and peculiar than most other Fords. But then it is French!

Have a good look through the Forscan PIDs (in the read PID data section, and press the spikey wheel at the bottom), see if there is anything relevant to additive level or dose count. You could try resetting the additive tank (FACM) again, using the service procedure. If in any doubt about the amount of Eolys in the tank, you could resort to adding it manually, either Eolys, or a DPF cleaner that contains cerium oxide, the active stuff in Eolys. Some of the Wynns DPF cleaners have this it seems, though it is hard to be really sure.

The wiring drawing I have (from this site) shows that pins are allowed for on the connectors between tank and FACM, for a level signal, but shown as not connected. Most information I have seen suggests there is no level sensor, but it could vary over time or versions. Maybe some cars do have one.

[Lewie]

Thanks Peter.

Interesting. I tried to run the DPF clean procedure the other day but it cancelled itself.
I'm assuming Forscan won't run it as the fluid level is showing low.
Perhaps my best bet is to add another litre of fluid and reset the error and see how it goes.
It's just a pain doing it.
'Designers' need a bullet!

[TomsFocus]

You can use ELMConfig to show a very basic 'level'.  It works out how many mg of Eolys have been dosed using injection times...but it's really not very accurate!

Do you tend to fill the tank or just do a tenner at a time?  The Eolys is dosed when you open the tank flap, but it's not accurately measured against how many litres you put in, so people that fill small amounts each week get through it more quickly than those brimming the tank once a month.

[Lewie]

Tom, we hardly go anywhere (not good for a diesel), it had 74,000 miles on the clock in January 2015, it has now done 83,000!!!
We tend to put around £25 a time so the flap is opened about once every three weeks if that.
Though it did have a good run earlier this year, Midlands to south Cornwall and back.
The Eolys tank, I believe, holds 1.8 litres and lasts around 35,000 miles.
I got the last error around the 70 odd thousand miles area so I'm guessing it was due it's second refill.
I put 1 litre in (less spillage :-)) 
As I said, the car has now done 83,000 miles so even if I did it as soon as I had the car (which I didn't), the 1 litre of fluid has only lasted 9,000 miles.
Perhaps not fully replenishing the tank messes things up?
But then that indicates the presence of a sensor.
I must say, until I looked at the paperwork I didn't realise how few miles I've done.
Must get out more or get a Eco boost.

[TomsFocus]

I don't do many miles either but I always brim the tank...can last me 6 weeks in winter lol!! 

That said, I don't quite do as few as you...I'm surprised you don't have any DPF blocking issues tbh.  Or maybe you do but they're not showing up as faults?  It might be worth running live data on the DPF pressure sensor, and also the glow plugs, just to check both of those are working well and not being masked by other faults.  They can both cause the dash warning light.

I agree 9k can't possibly have used so much Eolys...unless the doser is broken anyway.

 

[Lewie]

See first post, there were blockage issues which is why I tried to run the static regeneration but it wouldn't have it.
Kept cancelling.
As one of my options is getting rid and getting a Fiesta/Focus Eco boost I may refill the Eolys and see what happens.
I don't want to just clear the codes and hood wink the next owner.
 

[Lewie]

Right then
I have now added a litre of Eoyls to the DPF tank. (not a drop spilt this time!!)
Second time I've done it and can't believe how easy it was compared with last time, preparation is everything.
I ran Forscan service procedure for refilling the tank.
I cleared each fault category individually and then cleared 'all' for good measure.
I rescanned with Forscan.
The engine malfunction has gone so the fill code has been cleared.
The only code I get now is PCM P2002-21, Particle Filter Efficiency Below Threshold 
Telling me the following

Additional Fault Symptom:
 - Signal is Above Maximum Threshold

Status: 
 - Previously Set DTC - Not Present at Time of Request
 - Malfunction Indicator Lamp is Off for this DTC

Module: Powertrain Control Module

Diagnostic Trouble Code details

Particulate Trap Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1)

This DTC may be caused by :

Absense Of Particle Filter

Delta Pressure Sensor Hoses Incorrectly Fitted Or Damaged

Restriction/blockage in air intake system.

Check the following:

Check that the differential pressure sensor and hoses are intact and not blocked.

Check The Filter Is Fitted

Is this likely to be because the car doesn't do enough high temperature miles?
Can I fix it?
The Forscan Diesel Particulate Filter Static Regeneration service still won't go beyond the first minute or so, it then cancels.
Anyone know a cure or some other way of doing it? Lots of miles at high revs?
Cheers 

[TomsFocus]

Well that looks like the opposite of a blockage...that's the sort of code you get after gutting the DPF...I assume the DPF hasn't been gutted?

Can you check the DPF pressure differential on live data through Forscan and post up the graph, or at least the maximum you can get it to under load at around 3000rpm.

[Tdci-Peter]

4 hours ago, Lewie said:

Anyone know a cure or some other way of doing it? Lots of miles at high revs?

It is unlikely to have much effect. To do a regen, either a normal active regen or a forced one, the ECU adjusts injection timing and amount to put extra heat into the exhaust, and can also use the 1 or 2 throttle valves and EGR to increase temperature. These changes are more effective than high rev driving. Maybe pulling a caravan up a big Alpine hill a few times would have an effect, as it needs both torque (to get the fuel) and rpm to really raise the exhaust temperature.

The best and long term answer is to locate what it is complaining about. Leaky hoses between DPF and the DP sensor are a very common fault. Like Tom says, a graph of DPF_DP, rpm, MAP, APP (accelerator) etc would at least indicate whether the DP was too high or too low. The DTC explanation does suggest low DP, but I have learnt to never entirely trust DTCs. They are clues, but not always quite right.

[Lewie]

NoTom
DPF as factory as far as I know.

Not sure exactly what you are both on about regarding graph, I'm assuming it's to do with the 'Read DPF Data' section?
I'll take a peep at Forscan how to's unless you can give me a clue as to what I do?
Thanks both

Still not getting notifications regarding replies which is a pain. 

[Tdci-Peter]

3 hours ago, Lewie said:

Not sure exactly what you are both on about regarding graph,

I am not sure which version of Forscan (windows / android / ios) you have. But I think all can do data logging & graphing. On my windows version the 3rd Icon down the side is a graph symbol called read PID data. A PID is just a name for variable that can be read from the car. Click on that, and down the bottom is a spikey wheel. Click on that (needs to be connected to the car), and it will come up with a list of PIDs. That is all the readings it can access.

There are two columns, the right one may be empty. Click on any interesting looking PIDs in the left column, then on the arrow pointing right, it should copy the selected PIDs into that column. Then click the ok button, then the start (play arrow down the bottom). It should start reading variables into a matrix of boxes. On the top are tabs to change the display from dashboard (matrix of boxes) to graph or simple table. So just like this you can read all sorts of data direct out of the engine and the rest of the car.

There is also, down the bottom,  stop, save and load buttons. You can record data for a few seconds or more. I have done up to about 45 minutes while driving, more than this gets a bit heavy on data and hard to navigate around in.  Then press stop, then save. Then you can read the data back at any later time, and look at it in the graph, table or dashboard modes. You do not need to be connected to the car to read back data.

To upload graphs to a site like this, I set the graph to white (button in bottom left), find an interesting bit, then use PrintScrn button on the keyboard to copy a screenshot, and then paste (Ctrl-V) it into a picture editor like Paint. Save it as a .PNG, and upload. Simples. (ish!)

There is quite a lot there, but it can all be done in stages, setting up a list of PIDs, displaying them, saving, then the screen shot & upload if needed.

Here is a screenshot I did some time ago:

Part of a 1189 second (20 minute) run.

Reading data from a car should be no risk to the car at all, providing your ELM seems to be sound and reliable. I have never had any wobblies from my car while driving and downloading quite a lot of data. No need to even glance at the screen while driving, either: Setup & start, and stop, while parked. Then review at leisure (after saving, it does not do this automatically, as I found out at least once!)

Forscan can do a lot of harm, like erasing all keys, or wiping the ECU memory, but you would have to be very determined to do these things "accidentally". It always warns, as far as I have seen, before doing an irreversible action.

[Lewie]

Okie bloomin dokie.

Here is a graph
If I'm reading it right it's saying that my ash tray is nearly full!!
On the other hand I may be talking muck.
What ya think?

[TomsFocus]

Right ok, the main one there is the DP DPF one...it shouldn't be 0.0 at idle let alone 3k lol.  Should be some resistance of the DPF core, plus any ash and soot as well.

If you're totally sure the DPF hasn't been gutted, the next thing to check is the DPF pressure pipes.  They're rubber and run from the DPF up to the sensor on the side of the battery.  They're likely to be completely broken off somewhere at the DPF end I reckon.

 

[Lewie]

Well, thanks for the diagnosis Tom, however it's not what I want to hear.
Could you please edit your post and tell me that all is well. 😭

That's gonna be a cramped search!

[Lewie]

Had a look.
Went under the car, could see no sign of damage.
Went under the bonnet and low and behold there is a braided pipe attached to absolutely nothing.
So Tom, you were almost bang on except it was the front not the rear (hoping it's not both).
The second one isn't looking too healthy either.
I will do some searching but just in case I can't find what I'm after has anyone done this job?
What do I need (what are the two braided bits called?) I'm assuming I don't need to pay silly money for genuine parts, any braided hose of the right diameter would do?
What do I need to remove to get at the blighters?
Cheers thus far. 

[TomsFocus]

The DPF is at the front on this engine, it's that big can underneath the turbo.  

You can use any rubber or silicone pipe really, the braiding is just a cover to stop the pipes getting chafed.  I don't know what size the pipe is off hand I'm afraid, you'll need to measure the internal diameter of it.

You just need to remove the air filter box to get access to the pipes.  The airbox itself is just a push fit so just pulls upwards, but you'll need to undo the jubilee clip holding the air piping to the turbo, unplug the MAF sensor and remove a small elastic band near the bonnet catch to fully remove the airbox.

[Lewie]

Off course, what a pin head I am.
I was thinking DPF oil tank not the actual filter DOH!

Apparently they are two different sizes, one 6mm the other 8mm.
If I can't do it immediately I take it no harm will be done?

[TomsFocus]

It's probably been like that for weeks tbf, another few days won't hurt!  

The DPF won't regenerate without the sensor input though, so it's worth sorting as soon as you can.